Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

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Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby Topic Starter Robot » Sun May 11, 2014 9:02 pm

20 2020 Pennies 6 7 8 9 10 11
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby LadyObvious23 » Sun May 11, 2014 10:44 pm

She's making a bad decision. But at least she's taking a chance.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby CEOIII » Sun May 11, 2014 10:52 pm

There's a guy called Beaglerush on YouTube. He does these "Let's Play"esque vids for X-COM. And he said something once in one of them that's relevent here. Every so often in X-COM, you have to take a bad shot. It's like 39%, 0% chance to crit, but it's your only option. Or, as he put it.....

Sometimes, you gotta roll the hard 6.

Penny did that here. Whatever the consequences, orange rain future, fat mom future, biker chick future........she rolled the hard 6.

And every so often in X-COM, you make that 39% shot. (A good hard and fast rule in X-COM is "if the percentage isn't in the 60s, do something else." But sometimes you can't. So, yeah, roll the hard 6.)
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby Twitcher » Mon May 12, 2014 3:45 pm

6. I'm assuming "our" Pen's the attorney. Good on her. Biker Pen protests too much: She's proud of Penny's moxie later on, but she never did grow out of the cliquedom, she's saying what she thinks her other selves want to hear in this strip.
7. Apenkalypse wants the freedom to say screw it all, but what about when society rebuilds? How would she do with Left 4 Dead's infected? The Living Dead's Ghouls? Max Brook's Zack? http://www.thezombiehunters.com/index.php Jenny Romanchuk's Zombies? She can't cooperate worth a damn, and Counselor knows that Rich can be even worse at teamwork.
9. PENNY!? QUELLE SURPRISE! :roll:
10. All I see in in this strip is Penny declaring that she's doing this... just 'CAUSE! Shuddup already! And even that sounds flimsy. But we're in her head, here, and we make bad decisions because they seem like good ideas at the time, so she should be making this sound GOOD. She isn't. She's doing this so she can rebel against herself, but her dialogue should hide that fact. Biker Pen: "Ya got stones girl. PEACE!"
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby Alice Macher » Mon May 12, 2014 3:58 pm

Twitcher wrote:6. I'm assuming "our" Pen's the attorney.


"Six Septembers Later" reveals that Penny in fact went into public relations. Aggie is the one who's en route to practising law.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby timemonkey » Mon May 12, 2014 4:15 pm

Twitcher wrote:6. I'm assuming "our" Pen's the attorney. Good on her. Biker Pen protests too much: She's proud of Penny's moxie later on, but she never did grow out of the cliquedom, she's saying what she thinks her other selves want to hear in this strip.
7. Apenkalypse wants the freedom to say screw it all, but what about when society rebuilds? How would she do with Left 4 Dead's infected? The Living Dead's Ghouls? Max Brook's Zack? http://www.thezombiehunters.com/index.php Jenny Romanchuk's Zombies? She can't cooperate worth a damn, and Counselor knows that Rich can be even worse at teamwork.
9. PENNY!? QUELLE SURPRISE! :roll:
10. All I see in in this strip is Penny declaring that she's doing this... just 'CAUSE! Shuddup already! And even that sounds flimsy. But we're in her head, here, and we make bad decisions because they seem like good ideas at the time, so she should be making this sound GOOD. She isn't. She's doing this so she can rebel against herself, but her dialogue should hide that fact. Biker Pen: "Ya got stones girl. PEACE!"

As I said last week, Penny knows this is stupid, knows her thing with Rich is already doomed, knows this won't be anything but a mistake. But she wants to be the kind of person whose willing to take that risk. That's what's important to her, not being with Rich, not freedom, not even having an adventure, just being the kind of person who would try.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby Twitcher » Mon May 12, 2014 6:10 pm

Penny's trying, however, to convince herself that she's doing this for "this man!" So we should be sold on that opinion.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby Artemisia » Mon May 12, 2014 8:19 pm

I'll say what I would have said back when this first came out...I vote for the future that results in Penny getting together with Aggie :p
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby brasca » Tue May 13, 2014 2:55 am

Artemisia wrote:I'll say what I would have said back when this first came out...I vote for the future that results in Penny getting together with Aggie :p


Considering at what stage of Penny's life this occurs if someone told her she'd hook up with Aggie then she would immediately take the advice of whichever Penny avoided that. Pride over making decisions for herself be damned.

After reading this over numerous times her future success and chances at happiness are about 50/50 even with the Pennies who remained with Rich. Ironically, the one who's the happiest that remained with Rich is the one who lives in an apocalyptic hell. The defense attorney does well for herself, but she'd probably do better if she was a corporate attorney. And then there is the biker who regrets running away with Rich, but might also be saying that out of loneliness since her Rich died. She looks pleased with Penny's decision to leave with Rich so I think I'm right about her regretting his death more than the decision.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby timemonkey » Tue May 13, 2014 10:58 am

Nah, I think Penny is more self aware than that. I think she knows she's somewhat attracted to Aggie, she seems to use that 'If you saw that 1 in 20 chance to be happy wouldn't you go for it' motto a lot after this point.



In a way I pity Penny, she's too smart for her own good and can never just do anything without her mind figuring out all the angles first.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby FlyingFish » Tue May 13, 2014 9:05 pm

Alice Macher wrote:
Twitcher wrote:6. I'm assuming "our" Pen's the attorney.


"Six Septembers Later" reveals that Penny in fact went into public relations. Aggie is the one who's en route to practising law.

Also, Attorney!Pen was one of the three who stayed with Rich (guess she didn't call KA? or talked Rich out of ditching her at the motel?) Although both PR!Pennies didn't go with him in the first place. Our Penny, most likely, isn't represented here at all.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby Artemisia » Tue May 13, 2014 9:49 pm

She's probably represented there in some form, but she may not have been one of the most likely versions of her future at the time.
There was a girl who had a little curl right in the middle of her forehead, and when she was good, she was very, very good, and when she was bad she was homicidal.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby brasca » Wed May 14, 2014 9:38 am

FlyingFish wrote:
Alice Macher wrote:
Twitcher wrote:6. I'm assuming "our" Pen's the attorney.


"Six Septembers Later" reveals that Penny in fact went into public relations. Aggie is the one who's en route to practising law.

Also, Attorney!Pen was one of the three who stayed with Rich (guess she didn't call KA? or talked Rich out of ditching her at the motel?) Although both PR!Pennies didn't go with him in the first place. Our Penny, most likely, isn't represented here at all.


Only 2 of the Penny's that stayed behind reconsidered including the actress and the one who was finding herself. She looked so much like present Penny I had to check what outfits they were wearing to be certain. Perhaps she reconsidered going so she could evolve, but at least she was better off than fat Penny who devolved so badly she couldn't even make up her mind, but was relieved when her existence ended. Karen supposedly bests her in that reality, but judging at how beaten down she looks I'd estimate that by the time she graduated Helen was actually more popular.

On the other side four of the Penny's that followed her reconsidered including the Mom, the biker, the counselor, and Borg Penny. We learned the reasons from the biker and the counselor which were sound enough, but it would be interesting to conjecture the others. I think the Mom became a mom with someone other than Rich. I doubt he'd settle down and even if he did he wouldn't be some Ward Cleaver. She probably considered it a youthful mistake, but I would think undoing it would also break the chain of events that lead to her becoming who she is. Maybe she secretly wanted her existence to end too.

Borg Penny is largely a nightmare fantasy, but I'm still curious. Maybe she survived the wreck that killed Rich.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby TCampbell » Thu May 15, 2014 8:32 am

timemonkey wrote:
Twitcher wrote:6. I'm assuming "our" Pen's the attorney. Good on her. Biker Pen protests too much: She's proud of Penny's moxie later on, but she never did grow out of the cliquedom, she's saying what she thinks her other selves want to hear in this strip.
7. Apenkalypse wants the freedom to say screw it all, but what about when society rebuilds? How would she do with Left 4 Dead's infected? The Living Dead's Ghouls? Max Brook's Zack? http://www.thezombiehunters.com/index.php Jenny Romanchuk's Zombies? She can't cooperate worth a damn, and Counselor knows that Rich can be even worse at teamwork.
9. PENNY!? QUELLE SURPRISE! :roll:
10. All I see in in this strip is Penny declaring that she's doing this... just 'CAUSE! Shuddup already! And even that sounds flimsy. But we're in her head, here, and we make bad decisions because they seem like good ideas at the time, so she should be making this sound GOOD. She isn't. She's doing this so she can rebel against herself, but her dialogue should hide that fact. Biker Pen: "Ya got stones girl. PEACE!"

As I said last week, Penny knows this is stupid, knows her thing with Rich is already doomed, knows this won't be anything but a mistake. But she wants to be the kind of person whose willing to take that risk. That's what's important to her, not being with Rich, not freedom, not even having an adventure, just being the kind of person who would try.


I've sort of resisted chiming in here for my usual reasons, but I'd have to take a little issue with this interpretation. Penny absolutely does not know for certain that it is doomed and will not be anything but a mistake. She knows that it is very likely it will not work out. In fact, she's willing to concede the odds don't even look good. But there is a chance. The point of taking chances is chances, not masochistically engineering your own future misery.

She chooses love over everything, and I think there's something important about that. Yes, it's foolish, yes, it's the kind of decision parents dread, yes, she's not half as farsighted as she thinks she is, yes, yes, yes. But still, there's something important there. The contradiction is what gets to me.

Even at the time this came out, most of Penny and Aggie's commenters were adults looking back on their teen years. While that's a useful perspective, it's unfair at best and silly at worst to expect teens themselves to share it-- as unfair as it would be to measure our actions today based only on what our parents think or would think. Teens are somewhere between children in need of protection and people who must and should make their own decisions and their own "mistakes," which may not even really be mistakes if they result in growth, growth that we as adults may take for granted.
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Re: Re-read week 84: 20 2020 Pennies 6 - 11

Postby timemonkey » Thu May 15, 2014 9:07 am

*Shrug* She and Rich couldn't make it work even under their best circumstances, he's demonstrated a willingness to but his image above both their safety and her feelings, he's throwing away not only his future but asking her to toss away her's to make some big stupid rebellious gesture that any sane person could see is doomed to failure, and she seems to really only be upset he didn't trust her rather than the relationship ending again. Maybe she wasn't coldly calculating it out like I made it sound, but you wrote her smart enough to see all of that so I assumed she did. Even in all her future selves the only real positive things we see of a life with Rich is if the entire world goes to hell and she needs to rely on violence to survive. It seems that, consciously or otherwise she's willing to err on the side of passion even if everything about it screams mistake.
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