You Heard It Here First...

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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Trefle » Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:50 pm

DDDDD:

Yeah, I'm also all sad here. And the community! Man, what a community. I hope we can stay here..but under what form? ;__;
..well, I know how creators have a special perspective when it comes to their works. I wish you all the best with the rest of your work, T, and while I haven't followed Fans! or Guilded Age...I may consider doing so. :P

At least you're not undecided anymore, T. *rimshot*

As far as QUILTBAG goes..my perspective on this, aside from the amount of (branching, no less!) characters, QUILTBAG has the burden of carrying the torch of 2 P&A stories. It probably went too soon with the drama (Iseul's, in particular). I agreed with Bardlp; it does not get enough time for characterization (other than Sara and Lisa); Iseul, for instance, we only refer as 'the cheating possibly lesbian spouse', and no other angle. Compare with Penny in, say, 2020 Pennies. I don't think it's -bad-, but it's certainly feel more....honed, more focused. In effect, a bit awkward. I thought with time it will find its own voice, like how P&A naturally changed along time, but sadly..

I'd also love what Tamar said; even if you're closing the door on -this- particular story, I do hope at some point you'll continue with the stories here; in some way or another.
As far as GWS's characters mentioned here, I do feel the same; that Clarice sometimes feel a little bit less...dom, and Darren is WAY too two dimensional; but I sort of think that was DCorsetto's intention, sort of;
Clarice was supposed to be more 'librarian' and less 'dom', while Darren's two dimensional-ness....is not something unseen in the real world.

Either way, I'm still sticking around here. Thank you so much for a good year's run, T. :)
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Artemisia » Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:55 pm

I wrote to GWS' creator about Darren...actually, I and several of my family know gay men like him. There are some who play up the stereotype. He reminds me a bit of Patrick Stewart's character in Jeffrey.
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Fen » Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:11 pm

But what reason will I have left to get up in the morning on Mondays, T?
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Zanosuke Kurosaki » Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:36 pm

Fen wrote:But what reason will I have left to get up in the morning on Mondays, T?


Well, if you'd like, he and I could have a website "edit war" like C+A+D (jokingly) did a few years back, with Bryan Clevinger of Nuklear Power supposedly "defacing" his site*, and every Monday I could (under pseudonyms, of course) find new and interesting ways for the site to greet people each week. :D (T, please don't kill me.)

*(The "defacement" was done with full permission from C+A+D's owner and they did it just to be silly, really.)
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby mindstalk » Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:48 pm

I measure QUILTBAG against Girls With Slingshots and Dumbing of Age, and those strips just completely kick its ass. (If you're looking for enlightened perspective on modern sexuality and/or great characterization and dramedy in a college setting, I'd look there.)


I read both of those regularly, and the comparison strikes me as very odd. So do the descriptions; I wouldn't have thought of GWS as primarily a "enlightened perspective on modern sexuality". I don't think you've had anything to feel inferior about in comparison with those strips.

(Though an interesting contrast: we've criticized you for going too fast and skipping too much time; DoA regularly gets comments about how it's crawling through realtime, much like Girl Genius. Several months for the first week of college.)

Now, I hadn't known that you were planning on making the letter-chapters topical one-to-one with the components of QUILTBAG as well as a literary constraint on the first panel. I hadn't mapped the first two chapters to Questioning or Uncertain. If you think having the third chapter be about Intersex would be a bad idea, I'd suggest you might be right, *but* that you've got good characters and setting here that you could keep telling stories about, without an overly tight constraint. We the readers care about Sarah and Lisa, and Michael and Marie, and Temperance, and Iseul and Theo. That's pretty big.
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby AngFdz » Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:27 pm

I never liked Quiltbag as much as P&A... maybe the format of 3 updates a week just wasn't enough to cover the complexity of human sexuality. Do what you think is right, T. We will continue to support you and your projects. :) It helps to know you have you're thinking about how you're investing your time and the amount of effort you're putting into them.
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Pink Freud » Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:58 pm

I couldn't really identify much with QUILTBAG, but I was still enjoying it, and I'm sad to see it go. Since that fateful day when I first clicked on that link from Sluggy Freelance, with the picture of the pretty blonde looking stymied as the heat death of the universe ensued, my life was changed forever. Well, my online life at least. This is the first and only webcomic community that I've ever become so involved in, and I believe that I'm much the better for it. The only looming, frightful question that I have now is...

WHAT WILL I CUT THE EYES OUT OF NOW?! HUH? ANSWER ME THAT!
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Azrael44 » Tue Sep 25, 2012 1:59 am

Good luck, T and thank you very much. See you on the next project.
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Ozaline » Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:47 am

It was an interesting project and idea, but I can see the problems in it. I hope you aren't done with these characters and revisit them in the future in another format, but even if you don't you've earned a lot of lifelong fans.

I was a late-comer to P&A and I don't post on the forum much but I've made great friends in this community, and I eagerly await your future projects (and I'm enjoying Webmasters of course).
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Twitcher » Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:51 am

With Quiltbag, it seemed like T was having trouble shaping the story to fit a theme, rather than having a theme serve the story... should I strike that and reverse it? It seemed labored, I guess. But I really liked the variety of characters, I don't think they were crutches at all. I wanted to see more of them and who they were, who they wanted to be, and who they'd become over time. What'll happen to Ronnie? I'm sticking with Guilded Age, because I want to see what Harky and H.R.'s plans are/were for the "five-to-seven", why it's so world-shaking that a wrench was thrown in them, and if and how this impacts the "real world."
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Bardlp » Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:26 am

Lia S wrote:
Bardlp wrote:Sorry to see QUITLBAG go, but I support your decision.


:lol: I’m glad this sad news at least led to a typo that made me giggle.


I hate everything! :D

I sort of think that was DCorsetto's intention, sort of;
Clarice was supposed to be more 'librarian' and less 'dom


She's a pro-dom, she gets paid to beat on people in sexy ways, and she doesn't get how safewords work. Other aspects of her character aside (I actually quite like the not-knowing-how-to-find-a-bottom-who-is-also-submissive-and-boyfriend-material subplot), that's a pretty huge problem. If your bottom reds out it means "If you do that one more time I'm coming down off this cross and tearing your ovaries out with my bare hands", not "Oh, okay, I'm satisfied now". That's like being a mechanic and not knowing that if the car blows up you may have done something wrong.
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby CBrachyrhynchos » Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:34 am

Good luck, I think I read a great piece by Gaiman a while back that sometimes, the great idea just doesn't work out.
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Zanosuke Kurosaki » Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:09 pm

Bardlp wrote:
Lia S wrote:
Bardlp wrote:Sorry to see QUITLBAG go, but I support your decision.


:lol: I’m glad this sad news at least led to a typo that made me giggle.


I hate everything! :D

I sort of think that was DCorsetto's intention, sort of;
Clarice was supposed to be more 'librarian' and less 'dom


She's a pro-dom, she gets paid to beat on people in sexy ways, and she doesn't get how safewords work. Other aspects of her character aside (I actually quite like the not-knowing-how-to-find-a-bottom-who-is-also-submissive-and-boyfriend-material subplot), that's a pretty huge problem. If your bottom reds out it means "If you do that one more time I'm coming down off this cross and tearing your ovaries out with my bare hands", not "Oh, okay, I'm satisfied now". That's like being a mechanic and not knowing that if the car blows up you may have done something wrong.


I've always felt that Danielle wrote Clarice as someone who ended up getting some pretty skewed ideas of what dom and sub are (after all, she hangs around with -Candy-, who is pretty messed up), not that the author didn't know it herself. Clarice has just always struck me as someone who only ever read a website or two on it , decided that's who and what she was, and never bothered to check further into it (I can't help but think of a rather infamous example elsewhere on the web, where someone who has some very narrow and rigid definitions for sexualities put up a web site that lots of people went to and thought it was a help for their confusion - only to end up needing a lot of therapy, thanks to this self-absorbed person.)
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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Valerie » Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:31 pm

oddtail wrote:This IS a little disappointing, but while I don't like the decision, I like the reasons you made the decision, T.


I guess this is how I feel about it, too. A person needs to know zir limitations.

For what it's worth, T, I think you did a pretty good job of expressing the QUILTBAG community. A much better job than a lot of other (presumably) straight, white men might have. :P You actually took the time to learn enough to put this together, and you took the time to listen to us when we thought something was a little off (like the infamous "tranny" incident). Coming from someone who considers herself part of the QUILTBAG community, that means a lot.

And I ended up learning things, since your comic prompted discussions. I know a lot more about the trans* community now than I did at the start, for example. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who's been made better by this.

I've said this like twenty different times by now, but I am ridiculously thankful for this forum. The people here have helped me a lot, in many ways. I've learned a lot about quite a few subjects, and I've been able to feel intellectually on-par with the members (or even intellectually inferior at times, which is nice when you're used to being the only non-stupid person in your local area).

There have been so many times that I felt I didn't have anyone else to talk to. My family is largely useless, and I've never had a knack for making friends in the real world. (And, well, I certainly can't afford therapy.) The members on this forum have helped me more than I can express, and I truly will be sad to see it go, if it does go. But at least I had it for a little while.

Thank you for all of this, T.
Lia S wrote:Valerie is right.

As usual.


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Re: You Heard It Here First...

Postby Bardlp » Wed Sep 26, 2012 7:59 am

Zanosuke Kurosaki wrote:I've always felt that Danielle wrote Clarice as someone who ended up getting some pretty skewed ideas of what dom and sub are (after all, she hangs around with -Candy-, who is pretty messed up), not that the author didn't know it herself.


If you read the comments Danielle makes in response to people checking in on questionable Clarice stuff, that's pretty explicitly not the case. And, again, Clarice is supposed to be a professional who sometimes works in bdsm clubs -- her experience isn't just chatroom, and if she were that outside the norm people would have offered to help her before asking her to leave. "Public" venues tend to have pretty clear demarcations between what's acceptable and what isn't.
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