[4 Sept 12] We all have to get closure somehow

[Alice Macher]

Double standard, much? Why was Ronnie's punch unacceptable and this is "righteous anger FTW"?

I specifically said that I didn't approve of her punching him. Just her words.

[JerrBear]

Hank's playing the Pronoun Game.

[retrophrenologist]

Hank's playing the Pronoun Game.

Damn, he is a little, isn't he? I just realzed that Clarice doesn't know that Hank's last crush was (almost certainly) a guy.

[Artemisia]

Hank's playing the Pronoun Game.

I guess it's better than the Crying Game.

(I'm sorry to have made that joke, but sometimes...

...I really didn't like the movie all that much)

[JerrBear]

Hank's playing the Pronoun Game.

I guess it's better than the Crying Game.

[sun tzu]

Double standard, much? Why was Ronnie's punch unacceptable and this is "righteous anger FTW"?

I don't necessarily approve of the punch...
...But Ronnie punched over a perceived insult. Clarice punched over being used for sexual experimentation. Different orders of magnitude of wrongness.

[Gholateg]

Yeah, I knew nothing would happen over her punching him. Meh.

and for whoever said why not a groin kick? that would have hurt a lot more then a punch in the stomach.. so I agree with you.

[Kchoze]

Double standard, much? Why was Ronnie's punch unacceptable and this is "righteous anger FTW"?

I don't necessarily approve of the punch...
...But Ronnie punched over a perceived insult. Clarice punched over being used for sexual experimentation. Different orders of magnitude of wrongness.

From your point of view perhaps, from the point of view of Clarice and Ronnie, not so much. And I think that if the genders were reversed, no one would even try to justify that punch or do the lukewarm "I don't condone the punch... I just agree with it".

QUILTBAG is about exploring sexuality and gender, and I find it very interesting how it has just provided, intentionally or not, a clear example of a double standard based on gender. Ronnie punches a guy because he thought he insulted him and people cheer when he is arrested by the police. Hank then gets sucker punched by a girl and most people actually support the girl.

[NobodySpecial]

I simply do not get the full extent of the rage here.

If Hank is 'experimenting' or Hank is 'Bi' or Hank is 'Gay plus Clarice', he's done exactly one feel-em-up session in all the time he's been seeing her. He hasn't forced her to do anything, and he's respected the boundaries SHE set. I don't have much use for the guy, myself, but Jeez Louise - if he was a blank slate and this was his first ever, we'd be applauding his patience and practically giving out medals for him 'getting it' when it comes to respecting women. But because he's had a relationship with someone else of his gender, now all of a sudden he's a total bastard?

The theme of the chapter is U - UNDECIDED or UNKNOWN. Does Hank have to fit into your little shoebox regardless of what T's shown you so far? Can he only be GAY FOREVER! from now until eternity, amen?

[Captain LeBubbles]

Double standard, much? Why was Ronnie's punch unacceptable and this is "righteous anger FTW"?

I don't necessarily approve of the punch...
...But Ronnie punched over a perceived insult. Clarice punched over being used for sexual experimentation. Different orders of magnitude of wrongness.

From your point of view perhaps, from the point of view of Clarice and Ronnie, not so much. And I think that if the genders were reversed, no one would even try to justify that punch or do the lukewarm "I don't condone the punch... I just agree with it".

QUILTBAG is about exploring sexuality and gender, and I find it very interesting how it has just provided, intentionally or not, a clear example of a double standard based on gender. Ronnie punches a guy because he thought he insulted him and people cheer when he is arrested by the police. Hank then gets sucker punched by a girl and most people actually support the girl.

(Bolded for emphasis) Don't think for one minute this was unintentional- T knew exactly what he was doing when he threw in a girl throwing a punch right after a guy. (And don't think all of us agree with the punch even if we suggest that she's right to feel hurt or angry).

[nimoy]

I simply do not get the full extent of the rage here.

If Hank is 'experimenting' or Hank is 'Bi' or Hank is 'Gay plus Clarice', he's done exactly one feel-em-up session in all the time he's been seeing her. He hasn't forced her to do anything, and he's respected the boundaries SHE set. I don't have much use for the guy, myself, but Jeez Louise - if he was a blank slate and this was his first ever, we'd be applauding his patience and practically giving out medals for him 'getting it' when it comes to respecting women. But because he's had a relationship with someone else of his gender, now all of a sudden he's a total bastard?

I get Clarice's rage. I think she's really into Hank, finding someone who seems to fit with her for the first time, when most men make her squeamish and uncomfortable. So when she finds out she's being used as an experiment, by the first guy she's ever started to open up to, yeah, I can see her being pissed.

I just don't get the "crutch" and "lifeline" bit. That sounds like something more than an experiment, like she thinks he using her for support in a way he shouldn't be. It doesn't seem to fit with my understanding of her attachment to Hank....

Also, on the appropriateness of punching.... I relate to her anger, but the punching was unacceptable. I agree, it's a double standard. This double standard sucks. (It's especially awful when it comes to how the media depicts rape. Somehow when a man gets raped in a movie, it's HI-LARIOUS (especially if it's a female rapist), which is so so so not okay.) But coming back to this instance, I also believe a punch to the gut is WAAAAAY different that a punch to the head. A single punch to the gut is uncomfortable, but unlikely to cause serious damage. A single punch to the head can have much more serious consequences, especially if you hit your head a second time on the way down.

[brasca]

I simply do not get the full extent of the rage here.

If Hank is 'experimenting' or Hank is 'Bi' or Hank is 'Gay plus Clarice', he's done exactly one feel-em-up session in all the time he's been seeing her. He hasn't forced her to do anything, and he's respected the boundaries SHE set. I don't have much use for the guy, myself, but Jeez Louise - if he was a blank slate and this was his first ever, we'd be applauding his patience and practically giving out medals for him 'getting it' when it comes to respecting women. But because he's had a relationship with someone else of his gender, now all of a sudden he's a total bastard?

Some of the rage might be displaced. I agree that Clarice is possibly overreacting or angry that the one man who didn't want to take advantage of her actually did, but not in the same way she assumed. However, Hank appeared to be above it all and yet he really isn't. He never said he was so it's not like he's a liar, but he talks like freshmen know nothing and yet he's only marginally better so I find it annoying. The rest is still shrouded in mystery and once it's revealed I might be more forgiving or less. I know he witnessed something bad a few years ago, but there's a difference between an angry dude punching out someone for a perceived insult and someone presumably killed for being gay.

[NobodySpecial]

I simply do not get the full extent of the rage here.

If Hank is 'experimenting' or Hank is 'Bi' or Hank is 'Gay plus Clarice', he's done exactly one feel-em-up session in all the time he's been seeing her. He hasn't forced her to do anything, and he's respected the boundaries SHE set. I don't have much use for the guy, myself, but Jeez Louise - if he was a blank slate and this was his first ever, we'd be applauding his patience and practically giving out medals for him 'getting it' when it comes to respecting women. But because he's had a relationship with someone else of his gender, now all of a sudden he's a total bastard?

I get Clarice's rage. I think she's really into Hank, finding someone who seems to fit with her for the first time, when most men make her squeamish and uncomfortable. So when she finds out she's being used as an experiment, by the first guy she's ever started to open up to, yeah, I can see her being pissed.

But we - and she - do not know that for sure. Hank could be having genuine feelings of attraction/lust for her, and yet the entirety of the criticism is 'How dare that gay man lead a young heterosexual woman on with promises of a relationship!' Hell, we haven't even conclusively proved that he's gay and not bi.

[octopus_gardener]

...I'm even more confused now then when I read the strip. Too many blanks seem unfilled to really draw any conclusion?

I do have trouble parsing, especially based on Clarice's own earlier internal-monologue review, what exactly she perceives he did to her?

[Fen]

The reason why Ronnie gets punished for his violence whereas Clarice is not is the same reason for which a kid that tries to take some chocolate out of the store and gets caught might walk away whereas a guy who robs a bank does not.

A punch to the stomach is a few minutes worth of discomfort at best, especially since Clarice doesn't seem like the body building type. Hank's able to talk immediately after that, so made that a few seconds of discomfort (the fall might've hurt more, and that was the surprise factor rather than the punch).

versus

A punch to the side of the head from a big guy like Ronnie, full strength+ the fall, a hit big enough to cause a concussion, and if this weren't a comic maybe even more damage (it doesn't take much for a hit like that to have long-term consequences; it's a veeeery sensitive area).

So we have magnitude here. Now let's look at motivation.

Someone who was used versus someone who randomly decides to attack people. The chance of her being trouble to anyone in the future is pretty much nil; the chances of Ronnie losing it again? pretty big. Thus one is a potential danger, whereas the other is not.

A bit of balance is found in the Marie situation (the magnitude wasn't great, but big enough to count; however her motivation in doing so only got her a bit of embarassment as opposed to active punishment)


Isn't this actively seeking out people's misfortunes for the sake of proving your theory on equal treatment whilst ignoring all factors but the one you feel strongly about?