[7/09] Homework

[Killjoy]

OK, I went and took another look at the comic -- there's a pillow between them for friggin sakes!

Quick, somebody call the police.

[skullbie]

Wow, maybe i'm the only one who sees these comics as simple with no need to delve into little conspiracy theorys of how 'complex' they are. I'm sure this sounds rude but it's no worse than people in other topics arguing about threesomes and how much they hate the gays.

[posseforlife]

I don't know what's going on yet- but Michelle's father makes me... nervous.

Ok, see I was getting that feel too. Like I get the whole "closeness between father and daughter" thing. And I think it'd be great if thats where the comic is going, but at the same time, seeing as how lately more serious issues have been dealt with, I also agree with posters who think there is a possibility of a sexual abuse story here. Either way, I like that we're getting more in depth with the characters now. The histories of the characters who are around Penny and Aggie are helping show why these people are the way they are and why they are friends with who they are friends with. Excellent job either way this turns out.

[InkMonkey]

While I'm not ruling out sexual abuse as an arc that may well take place in the P&A universe, I doubt that that's the direction this storyline is heading. Michelle and her father (at least at this point in time) are close, and there doesn't appear to be any hints that it's anymore than that. Their proximity on the couch may account for discomfort among the readership, but I don't think that's anything more than the art style.

Anyway, for some reason, I can't help but think of the first comic from "The First Man I Ever Loved" series, where young Penny and her cohorts mysteriously despise good ol' Michelle Brown. When I first read it, I couldn't figure out why they disliked her, but it's definitely becoming clear. Michelle's dad is the only father seen among all four girls in their childhood who has no trouble playing with, approving, and accepting his daughter. The fathers of Helen, Sara, and Penny each seem to have a problem with one of these concepts.

Michelle seems to be more confident as a little girl than she is as a teenager, possibly due to the turn of the relationship she has with her dad. If she evetually realized that he was more of a big kid than a supporting parent, it's no wonder she's currently looking for approval from both friends and "another man." This could explain her seemingly endless stream of crushes and her current obsession with Stan. Sure, this can be dismissed as "just a thing that teenagers do," but her fears of being socially ostracised for her financial situation and her constant look-out for a boyfriend are evidence of deep insecurity. A character like Aggie, on the other hand, whose father is supportive and able to provide a stable home, has no trouble being a lone wolf or social outcast. Michelle is trying to avoid a life like that at all costs, possibly because she's scared that social dissaproval will put her on a similar path as her father.[/i]

[adamiani]

This could explain her seemingly endless stream of crushes and her current obsession with Stan. Sure, this can be dismissed as "just a thing that teenagers do," but her fears of being socially ostracised for her financial situation and her constant look-out for a boyfriend are evidence of deep insecurity. [/i]

Waaaaaait a minute. A normal, hormonally active teenage girl has to have serious underlying issues to want a boyfriend, and actually get one? I mean, bearing in mind that Aggie has a hopeless crush, Sara's deep in the closet, Penny serially dumps boys (and, if you listen to Sara, is also deep in the closet), Rich, Charlotte, Tharqua, Meg, Jack, Katy Ann, Helen, Lisa and Duane have given us no evidence of presently having significant others (and, in at least some cases, solid evidence that they do not, such as being at th . Michelle and Stan appear to be the only teens in their school presently dating. Statistically, SOMEONE has to be, surely? Her fear of ostracism and underlying insecurity are definitely facets of her personality, but I think pathologizing her relationship as "obsession" is a bit much.

[Davidj]

I have to agree that it doesn't look like he molested her. She doesn't even look uncomfortable or awkward to be that close to him. It's more like he's being irresponsible and too much of the fun parent.

Yeah. Just that night they've played a console game, Sorry and a card game and now they're watching TV. Mr. Brown is way too much fun. Her later comments on him don't send the "I've been horribly traumatised" message to me. More like "I'm fed up". I see two ways that could go:

1. She's mad because she's come to realise that he's all about the teh fun and not enough about taking care of business.

2. She's disappointed because he was so close to her when she was a little girl, but now his business problems have left him no time for her.

[admiralshazbot]

Perhaps the molestation idea came from the uncomfortable look on Michelle's face? She looks trapped, as if she's not there by choice and really can't get away.
I don't think Michelle was molested, though. Her approach to sex in "Behind Closed Doors" seemed too open and unencumbered by issues as heavy as that. Yeah, she was shy and nervous about it, but so are most virgins, especially when having sex goes from a theoretical concept to something they might actually experience in the near future.
Though she does mention her father right as she's about to start ripping her clothes off for Stan: http://www.pennyandaggie.com/index.php?p=375
That's actually very creepy any way I look at it. Mentioning a parent before sex is...ew.

[InkMonkey]

This could explain her seemingly endless stream of crushes and her current obsession with Stan. Sure, this can be dismissed as "just a thing that teenagers do," but her fears of being socially ostracised for her financial situation and her constant look-out for a boyfriend are evidence of deep insecurity. [/i]

Waaaaaait a minute. A normal, hormonally active teenage girl has to have serious underlying issues to want a boyfriend, and actually get one? I mean, bearing in mind that Aggie has a hopeless crush, Sara's deep in the closet, Penny serially dumps boys (and, if you listen to Sara, is also deep in the closet), Rich, Charlotte, Tharqua, Meg, Jack, Katy Ann, Helen, Lisa and Duane have given us no evidence of presently having significant others (and, in at least some cases, solid evidence that they do not, such as being at th . Michelle and Stan appear to be the only teens in their school presently dating. Statistically, SOMEONE has to be, surely? Her fear of ostracism and underlying insecurity are definitely facets of her personality, but I think pathologizing her relationship as "obsession" is a bit much.

Having urges and wanting a relationship are important parts of being a teenager, but her crushes before this story arc have seemed a little sudden, certainly compared to Aggie's long infatuation with Marshall and Rich's focus on Penny. Maybe she's not exactly in free-fall, but I defintely think Michelle's purposely looking for someone to hold onto.

You're right, "obsession" is a bit too harsh of a word to describe her feelings towards Stan. She definitely digs him, though, and if she finds out he's not into her, the poor lass is going to have her heart broken.

[InkMonkey]

That's actually very creepy any way I look at it. Mentioning a parent before sex is...ew.

Eek. No kidding.

[Killjoy]

Perhaps the molestation idea came from the uncomfortable look on Michelle's face? She looks trapped, as if she's not there by choice and really can't get away.

Might have something with the homework she needs to get to.

I don't think Michelle was molested, though. Her approach to sex in "Behind Closed Doors" seemed too open and unencumbered by issues as heavy as that. Yeah, she was shy and nervous about it, but so are most virgins, especially when having sex goes from a theoretical concept to something they might actually experience in the near future.
Though she does mention her father right as she's about to start ripping her clothes off for Stan: http://www.pennyandaggie.com/index.php?p=375
That's actually very creepy any way I look at it. Mentioning a parent before sex is...ew.

She's giving voice to a rebellious notion that many teens likely have on a subconscious level, the same one that sometimes leads to drinking, smoking, etc.

[Richter]

That's actually very creepy any way I look at it. Mentioning a parent before sex is...ew.

Eek. No kidding.

Erhm ... she's having sex with her beau on her parents' bed, which makes this look like a rebellion against being 'daddy's little girl'.

If any of the P&A characters have been molested, my bets would be on Charlotte. Would explain why she hates herself so much.

[Crystal_Pepsi]

Perhaps the molestation idea came from the uncomfortable look on Michelle's face? She looks trapped, as if she's not there by choice and really can't get away.

Might have something with the homework she needs to get to.

I don't think Michelle was molested, though. Her approach to sex in "Behind Closed Doors" seemed too open and unencumbered by issues as heavy as that. Yeah, she was shy and nervous about it, but so are most virgins, especially when having sex goes from a theoretical concept to something they might actually experience in the near future.
Though she does mention her father right as she's about to start ripping her clothes off for Stan: http://www.pennyandaggie.com/index.php?p=375
That's actually very creepy any way I look at it. Mentioning a parent before sex is...ew.

She's giving voice to a rebellious notion that many teens likely have on a subconscious level, the same one that sometimes leads to drinking, smoking, etc.

I was thinking the exact same thing as shazbot.
Besides the uncomfortable look she has it's not uncommon for a child to lie or make excuses to get away from their abuser... and how many kids that age do you know who are responcible enough to push away fun activities for homework?
Of course I could be completely wrong and she may just be worried about getting in trouble at school.
I hope that's the story is about her father living vicariously through her or just being irresponcible instead of a child molestation plotline.

Also, many teen may partake in sexual activites partially to defy their parents or authority figures... but I think that in those cases it's a subconsious rebellion.
I don't know many people who basicly blurt out "Hey I have daddy issues! Wanna f*ck?"

[Darky]

As someone who was molested by a family member who was very close to me as a kid, we spent all of our time together playing games and having fun, he was my best friend.. I can safely say that these comics are also making me very nervous.

I really, really hope that nothing like that is going to come into this little story and that they're just close, and her Dad is cool but irresponsible.

[MarilynMonroe]

My first impression about this page was: What the hell?! SILLY GIRL! NO HOMEWORK! MORE GAMES!!

By the way...where's the mother??

[candycornstomper]

There's s spoiler for a few books in this, so if you're reqading Speak, the Perks of Being a Wallflower, or Stained, I'd skip over this one.





Well, I don't think T or Gisele would make up a story where a little girl gets molested. That's normally something people who are either desperately trying to get over something that happened to them do, or something that molesters do. Everyone here thinks sexual abuse is terrible, but if anyone hasn't noticed, it's a big cop-out in many teen-oriented stories and things like that. People seem to think they can wrap everything up in a neat little box by saying the kid was crazy throughout the book because they were molested or beaten horribly or raped. Now, books like Speak and the Perks of Being a Wallflower do it really well, because they don't make it the main focus of the book, but in books like Stained, it's like that's all the author was interested in. There's a lot more things that a father can do to make his daughter "hate" him in the sense that teenagers hate my parents. Personally, my dad spoiled me as a kid and as I grew older, it was all taken away by my sisters, classmates, and "friends." Then he had spent so much time spoiling me and playing games with me as a kid that when I got a little older, all he wanted me to be was a little nine year old again and I couldn't, because I had great bouncing melons, lost my virginity at 14, and started trying to find myself. Most dads can't handle that. They think the nine year old you is the true you, and they say, "Hey! If you're really upset, why don't you just go put on some old clothes and play in the mud and pretend your Godzxilla again?" and you say "Dad, that was ten years ago. I haven't playe din the mud since I was seven." And he says, "Well you used to love it." "Duh. I was seven."

All I'm saying is that molestation is a very heavy subject, and not only as Michelle shown no signs of ever being molested, like she didn't flip her shit after having sex with Stan and hasn't shown any signs of untreated insanity, so it's probably a little more creative than that. I've never seen anything T and Gisele do involve something horrible just so they can stop working hard on coming up with good, original storylines.

Personally, fi Michelle's dad has molested her, I'd be so disgusted I'd stop reading. Unless done really well, most stories of child abuse are just sick and I've noticed tend to be perverse fantasies of the author drawn out into something they can physically see. It's just not... kosher.